Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Thu Sep 08, 2022 10:46 am  

Boss Hog wrote:

The current Super League teams don`t want to dilute their share of the Sky money, by sharing it with the new teams being introduced to the league.

Nail. On. The. Head.

The only way the game can move forward is to take the league up to 16/18 teams. The only way this will happen is if IMG bring new revenue streams / sponsorship into the game to supplement the Sky money.

I think the above will come from the addition of a 2nd cup tournament, like the Regal trophy being re-introduced, and the introduction of a new format like Rugby 7's or 9's to run side by side the Super League like the 100 does for Cricket. But the controversial part would be running it with Rugby Union consisting probably of about 30 teams (Super League & the Union Premiership teams).

Now I've mentioned the inclusion of a 'hybrid rugby' 7 / 9's comp I'll put on my tin hat and retreat to a bunker. But hopefully the clubs will buy in to what IMG come up with, otherwise the game will continue to shrink and die. But if they do it will be exciting times for rugby league, and rugby in general.

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Thu Sep 08, 2022 10:59 am  

I'd prefer a 14 team league with no relegation, playing each other once home and away, with no loop fixtures. This is what i'd prefer but who knows how it will look. But i do think the NRL have it right for developing players, if you can't be relegated there is no fear to blood youngsters and not have to rely on Aussies. I think it would definately improve English players in the long run and help secure sponsorships etc.
Spread the game in the UK, have London,, featherstone and a club further up north like Newcastle. Not as simple as that i know but with the channel 4 coverage it is starting to expand rugby league already

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 7:35 am  

Announcement's today as to the make up of the next 12 years

14 team SL or 20 teams split into two leagues with no promo or relegation into the 20

A massive decision to be made, let the debates begin

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 8:32 am  

Snaggletooth wrote:

Announcement's today as to the make up of the next 12 years

14 team SL or 20 teams split into two leagues with no promo or relegation into the 20

A massive decision to be made, let the debates begin

We might hear what is presented by IMG, but the votes won’t be till later in the year I believe.

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 9:17 am  

Both options have their downsides.

14 shuts out some promising clubs and restricts any further growth in France (although I wouldn't be allowing any more French teams in to the system without a TV deal). However it gets rid of loop fixtures and is a cheaper option than 2x10's I would expect whilst growing the amount of professional teams in the game.

2x10 allows us to widen the footprint and gives us an obvious way to add clubs to the SL system by expanding eventually to 2x12 as the teams and funding allow, BUT it means is more loop fixtures for the foreseeable. Loop fixtures don't bother me too much to be honest, I'd rather see us play Leeds / Saints / Wigan / Catalan 3 times a year than play Featherstone (or Batley if you take current results).

I can't see 2x10's working without a significant improvement in TV money and broadcasters willing to pay to televise SL2.

14 is probably better for right now, but 2x10's is the best way to grow the game for me, if people can get over the loop fixtures. Whatever they choose it needs to be stuck with and there needs to be a plan for the next 10 years plus, rather than just the here and now, we've become to reactionary in structure changes.

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 9:59 am  

Alffi_7 wrote:

Both options have their downsides.

14 shuts out some promising clubs and restricts any further growth in France (although I wouldn't be allowing any more French teams in to the system without a TV deal). However it gets rid of loop fixtures and is a cheaper option than 2x10's I would expect whilst growing the amount of professional teams in the game.

2x10 allows us to widen the footprint and gives us an obvious way to add clubs to the SL system by expanding eventually to 2x12 as the teams and funding allow, BUT it means is more loop fixtures for the foreseeable. Loop fixtures don't bother me too much to be honest, I'd rather see us play Leeds / Saints / Wigan / Catalan 3 times a year than play Featherstone (or Batley if you take current results).

I can't see 2x10's working without a significant improvement in TV money and broadcasters willing to pay to televise SL2.

14 is probably better for right now, but 2x10's is the best way to grow the game for me, if people can get over the loop fixtures. Whatever they choose it needs to be stuck with and there needs to be a plan for the next 10 years plus, rather than just the here and now, we've become to reactionary in structure changes.

Sorry but the loop fixtures are disastrous for the game

[Uncle Rico]

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 10:14 am  

REDWHITEANDBLUE wrote:

Sorry but the loop fixtures are disastrous for the game

I agree with you rather than Alffi. Playing Wigan and Saints (in our case) three times is OK,

However, it isn't usually just three, when you factor in Magic, The Challenge Cup and (ahem) the Play Off's. It can quite easily be five times, (will we be paired with Leigh next year?), but it soon becomes boring and devalues that 'big game' tag, including the build up.

I get why we have them from a resource POV but it does skew the league (yeah yeah yeah Old Trafford Leeds from 5th.....)

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 10:26 am  

REDWHITEANDBLUE wrote:

Sorry but the loop fixtures are disastrous for the game

Agree with this, I can't stand loop fixtures the league is not a fair system when you don't play the same fixtures as everybody else. That doesn't necessarily affect the top team but around the bottom of the playoffs and relegation if the points are tight it leaves a bit of a sour taste IMO. I think 2 leagues of 10 would really put me off rugby league.

Plus I think it devalues the big game feel between us and our nearest rivals a little. It's all just a bit too familiar a routine.

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 11:04 am  

REDWHITEANDBLUE wrote:

Sorry but the loop fixtures are disastrous for the game

As I said, plenty don't like them, I personally don't mind them. As a Wire fan I'd be confident we would get a better home attendance for Hull FC at home for the second / third time (taking in to account play offs / challenge cups) than Featherstone at home and I'd look forward to it more too.

Maybe that wouldn't be the case for Wakefield, maybe playing Wigan for the second / third time at home would get a lower home crowd than Leigh at home?

What happens to Bradford, London, Sheffield, York, Newcastle & Widnes in the 14? if as expected franchising comes in, they are left kicking their heels trying to be in a position to get a licence in 3 years time, when they get one having to recruit an entire new playing staff. What happens to Wakefield if they are bottom of the pile when the next round of licences are given out and we have a resurgent Bradford replacing them with a new stadium in the bag (ok unlikely!), where does that leave Wakefield for 3 years? You could keep P&R I guess, but the gulf between the two comps would be huge, its big now, so would only get bigger with 14.

I understand the feelings about playing teams 3 / 4 / 5 times a year, but there is no silver bullet here, we need the structure (and IMG will be focussing on much more than structure of course) that gives the best option for growth.

Re: IMG Are Seeking Your Views : Wed Sep 28, 2022 1:27 pm  

My idea for Super League is somewhat radical. And some of the concepts are adjusted from the NFL.

But the first thing I'd do is extend the number of Teams to 24. Lower the cap space to help the Championship clubs that move into the League at first, so top players from Super League can then be spread around the League, and lower the squad sizes. So for example, with a lower cap we might not be able to keep Daryl Clark on the books, but Halifax Panthers can now pick him up and add a top class player to their spine. And this can happen for all other teams. 3 Teams up and down every 3 years. And every 3 years we can also look at the value of the game and see if clubs can afford to increase their salary cap. The NFL Salary Cap changes year by year according to the value and profits of the game.

Play each team once. 11 home, 11 away, 1 Magic Weekend. Show 1 game live on YouTube for free on a Saturday and Sunday. Change from a point system to a record system. So if you win all 23 games you don't have 46 points, you're 23-0. This is another NFL concept which I think has a positive effect on how we view team progress year by year.

I think having more teams gives the League Leaders Shield more value... But then have 12 teams for playoffs, with the top 4 getting a BYE in the first round. Then you get 5th vs 12th, 6th vs 11th etc, so the extra teams that qualified have to get to the next stage on merit against tough opponents, whilst the best teams earn a rest and extra progress into the bracket.

Overtime should always find a winner. Teams get 2 straight sets to score points. This is another NFL-like concept I'd love to see... We get possession of the ball and we can either get a drop goal, penalty, try or try + conversion. After our possession, the other team gets their chance. If they don't match the points we got, we win. If they equalise, we start the process again. If they score more than we did, they win the game.

And finally, a new thought I've had on sin bins and red cards. I honestly think it ruins the game. I know old-school fans will say it has always been fine, but I think big games are ruined by cards. Take the GF between Wigan vs Saints for example, when Ben Flower was a bit naughty. He made the error but the team didn't, so I think a better solution would be to also copy the NFL on this and simply eject them from the game. Wigan put another man on the field but they now have to deal with having 3 subs, and they may have to change the structure. So with a Yellow or Red Card, the player is off, but the team still retains 13 players on the pitch. The player is either still gone for 10 minutes or the rest of the game and the team at least have to make changes and deal with some of the issues of missing a player in the squad. And I think teams winning as 13v12 makes wins less valuable/meaningful, since it can cause teams to win or lose matches they otherwise wouldn't if not for a card. Like when we beat Leeds in the first game of the season. Leeds would and should have won that game, but I wasn't even happy when we won. It just felt like a hollow victory.

We keep talking about new people/groups running Super League every few years. But it always feels like the game is getting smaller. Personally, I want to see a radical change to the 'product' and just try something new.