Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 9:32 am  

For mine some of these stats only tell part of the story.
I reckon Austin has given away at least 4 of his 8 penalties not kicking it 10 yards from kick offs or drop outs.

Smith and O’Connor do a lot of work but it’s largely passive defence. Bentley is doing a different job at times. He’s trying to get off the line fast and nail people to change the momentum. It did not really work on Friday in the wet but he gets a missed tackle against him when the ball carrier my have to change direction etc and I can’t recall them making a decent break because he missed one.

As for Smith and 24 carries, I reckon at least 6 of them would be a negative for me, where he takes a pace or 2 and does not pass wide fast enough, then comes inside aimlessly and gets tackled, still classed as a carry. I don’t want a ball playing loose forward getting tackled 24 times a game.

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 10:16 am  

Sir Gregory ParsloeP wrote:

For mine some of these stats only tell part of the story.
I reckon Austin has given away at least 4 of his 8 penalties not kicking it 10 yards from kick offs or drop outs.

Smith and O’Connor do a lot of work but it’s largely passive defence.

Austin has given a few away for high tackles, a few times he has shot out the line aggressively and got the tackle wrong, fair play to him as a half back trying to make a difference in defence.

Think that's a bit unfair on O'Connor, he is often the on leading the line in defence.

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 11:18 am  

leedsbarmyarmy wrote:

Austin has given a few away for high tackles, a few times he has shot out the line aggressively and got the tackle wrong, fair play to him as a half back trying to make a difference in defence.

Think that's a bit unfair on O'Connor, he is often the on leading the line in defence.

Spot on re Austin. I'd also add he throws in the odd very good tackle where he spots play opening up and nips it in the bud.

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:08 pm  

ArthurClues wrote:

We haven't signed any centres from the championship have we? Is Broadbent better than Newman, McDonald or Martin as centre. Definitely not. Academy (champions last year) players tend to be 18 or younger. Smith, quite rightly, doesn't think throwing 18 year old lads in with fully grown men is a wise way forward. Better to develop them in the reserves or on loan. Which of our championship signings do you have a problem with? McDonnell came from the Championship and forced his way into the first team in a very short time; McDonald looks our biggest attacking threat; Ruan had a great pre season and is starting for Bradford; Roberts scored a belter away at Leigh and also got one last week; Hooley had a shocker in a gale force wind at the most inhospitable ground in the league, but a bit premature to judge him on that. Which players would you have signed for this year?

The golden era was based on the progression of academy players through into the first team squad not filling the squad with average Championship players. Most of those academy players played in the first team by the time they were 20. Broadbent is a utility back who could play wing and centre and as such is better player than either Hooley or Ruan. Walker is on a different planet to Hooley - why he can't stay fit needs to better understood. McDonald is an average centre who has significant defensive issues. Both Ruan and Roberts starting at Bradford says it all - what was the score at Keighley? Even the coach said picking Ruan&Tindall was a mistake. The best signing for me is McDonnell who came from Wigan - no suprise there a SL youngster progressing

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:34 pm  

Walker is not a great player even when fit. He's not quick and can't pass. He runs some good lines every now and then. He's also, sadly, an utter crock which is a disaster in a salary cap world. Broadbent took his bat home when Smith arrived after not playing well and getting dropped in Smith's first game in charge. I'd rather he stayed but he clearly cracked the whatsits and left. He's not exactly the greatest centre ever and he's 22, not 19.

Your argument about Championship players doesn't make any sense because in terms of experience McDonnell was a championship player, and had played just 6 SL games in 3 years for Wigan. Sangare also played most of his rugby there.

The whole point of these signings - just to reiterate AGAIN - is that we have sweet FA quality players in their early 20s that the club has produced. Last season we were one injury away from picking 17 year-olds in the backs. Not because they were ready but because we had nobody else. Smith wants his backup players to be full grown men, not kids. He made that point very early in his stay last year.

The club is now focused again on bringing through kids. Fantastic. About time. But look at the quality of former Leeds juniors playing elsewhere who are under 25. Talk about mainly championship players...

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:36 pm  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

The golden era was based on the progression of academy players through into the first team squad not filling the squad with average Championship players. Most of those academy players played in the first team by the time they were 20. Broadbent is a utility back who could play wing and centre and as such is better player than either Hooley or Ruan. Walker is on a different planet to Hooley - why he can't stay fit needs to better understood. McDonald is an average centre who has significant defensive issues. Both Ruan and Roberts starting at Bradford says it all - what was the score at Keighley? Even the coach said picking Ruan&Tindall was a mistake. The best signing for me is McDonnell who came from Wigan - no suprise there a SL youngster progressing

The games changed from when the goldens came through. Throwing kids out to play every week at 18 is (rightly in my opinion) seen as the wrong way to go. And even back then the likes of McGuire and Burrow didn’t play every game. In reality there was always plenty of ‘squad’ players. Whether you’re talking Dunneman or Millard, or later on with the likes of Kirke, Worrall, Ambler. Our best squads have always had depth, some of which is from the academy but some were from other clubs or the championship.

For me this squad is the closest we’ve come in a while to getting the balance right. Some of the overseas quota just needs addressing now.

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:44 pm  

Sir Gregory ParsloeP wrote:

For mine some of these stats only tell part of the story.
I reckon Austin has given away at least 4 of his 8 penalties not kicking it 10 yards from kick offs or drop outs.

Smith and O’Connor do a lot of work but it’s largely passive defence. Bentley is doing a different job at times. He’s trying to get off the line fast and nail people to change the momentum. It did not really work on Friday in the wet but he gets a missed tackle against him when the ball carrier my have to change direction etc and I can’t recall them making a decent break because he missed one.

As for Smith and 24 carries, I reckon at least 6 of them would be a negative for me, where he takes a pace or 2 and does not pass wide fast enough, then comes inside aimlessly and gets tackled, still classed as a carry. I don’t want a ball playing loose forward getting tackled 24 times a game.

Quite correct, as I mentioned previously the stats are a useful tool but don’t paint the whole picture. For me one of the benefits is how much yardage the forwards are making. If you have a dominant pack you usually win your match. The stats will give you a rough idea as per the pack’s performances or lack of.

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:46 pm  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

The golden era was based on the progression of academy players through into the first team squad not filling the squad with average Championship players. Most of those academy players played in the first team by the time they were 20. Broadbent is a utility back who could play wing and centre and as such is better player than either Hooley or Ruan. Walker is on a different planet to Hooley - why he can't stay fit needs to better understood. McDonald is an average centre who has significant defensive issues. Both Ruan and Roberts starting at Bradford says it all - what was the score at Keighley? Even the coach said picking Ruan&Tindall was a mistake. The best signing for me is McDonnell who came from Wigan - no suprise there a SL youngster progressing

I disagree with just about all of that, and not surprisingly, just about everything else you post. No matter. It's all about opinions, as they say.

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 6:32 pm  

leedsbarmyarmy wrote:

Austin has given a few away for high tackles, a few times he has shot out the line aggressively and got the tackle wrong, fair play to him as a half back trying to make a difference in defence.

Think that's a bit unfair on O'Connor, he is often the on leading the line in defence.

My goal was not to bag O’Connor or Smith, I like them both but just to point out that these simplistic statistics are not all RL is about.

Re: SL RD 7 | Hull KR (A) : Wed Apr 05, 2023 10:06 pm  

On another note Ryan Hall is stronger than any of our props, can still finish and is safe under high ball. Looks 3-4 more years left to me …….would we for next season?