FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!

   WWW.RLFANS.COM • View topic - Shaw and Croft
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Club Captain2963
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 13 20186 years42nd
OnlineLast PostLast Page
18th Mar 24 22:5617th Mar 24 22:02LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Behind the Sticks
Signature
We're all Trin aren't we?

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 12:17 am  
To me, rules are rules.
They were made a contract offer and rejected it.
Don't see a problem with that....
dboy 
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach4115
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 12 200518 years108th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
18th Mar 24 22:1417th Mar 24 17:40LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Barnsley

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 5:21 pm  
The Avenger wrote:
I can assure you that for every player that attends and graduates college Trinity get an annual kickback that covers their wage


No, now you are being cute with your words.

It's an absolute fact that Wakefield College do not pay any money to any player.

They do pay an amount per player directly to the club. It's up to the club what they do with that money.

Whether you could argue it's the "same" money that the club pays to the players is moot.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
International Star4974
JoinedServiceReputation
Mar 07 201410 years95th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
18th Mar 24 21:0816th Mar 24 09:56LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 6:02 pm  
dboy wrote:
No, now you are being cute with your words.

It's an absolute fact that Wakefield College do not pay any money to any player.

They do pay an amount per player directly to the club. It's up to the club what they do with that money.

Whether you could argue it's the "same" money that the club pays to the players is moot.


Not when it’s exactly the same money and only those going to college get that amount.
I’m not guessing here, I know from multiple experiences that this is definitely what happens.

The point is though, when the clubs claiming to have put huge amounts of investment into developing players therefore they can justifiably claim compensation it’s not exactly true. As I said earlier The RFL fund the majority of the Academy and the College money takes up a fair amount of the cost too. So holding back 2 players and claiming compensation because they won’t sign a low value contract becomes immoral IMO
dboy 
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach4115
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 12 200518 years108th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
18th Mar 24 22:1417th Mar 24 17:40LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Barnsley

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 6:31 pm  
The Avenger wrote:
Not when it’s exactly the same money and only those going to college get that amount.
I’m not guessing here, I know from multiple experiences that this is definitely what happens.

The point is though, when the clubs claiming to have put huge amounts of investment into developing players therefore they can justifiably claim compensation it’s not exactly true. As I said earlier The RFL fund the majority of the Academy and the College money takes up a fair amount of the cost too. So holding back 2 players and claiming compensation because they won’t sign a low value contract becomes immoral IMO


You corrected my post and stated that Wakefield College paid the Trinity Academy players. They do not.

Nor is education is free (it's just "free" to the user).

I think we also looked after Croft through a season-long injury(?).
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach6035No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Nov 03 200419 years28th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
19th Mar 24 01:1018th Mar 24 19:24LINK
Milestone Posts
5000
10000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Signature
Top six 2005 - Trinity.

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 7:12 pm  
dboy wrote:
You corrected my post and stated that Wakefield College paid the Trinity Academy players. They do not.

Nor is education is free (it's just "free" to the user).

I think we also looked after Croft through a season-long injury(?).


Yes and gave him the opportunity after to find some form back in the first team.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Moderator20106
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 04 200815 years5th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
19th Mar 24 00:4919th Mar 24 07:22LINK
Milestone Posts
20000
25000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
wakefield
Signature
A dog is not considered a good dog because he is a good barker. A man is not considered a good man because he is a good talker - Buddha
Moderator

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 7:40 pm  
I don't really know why people are getting so upset about this.
The rules been in place for quite a while
No one at the club has said we wouldn't negotiate or waive the fee
No club has said they would sign them but won't because of the fee.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach4980No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Apr 06 200618 years246th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
26th Dec 23 15:2219th Oct 23 17:15LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Signature
'That is why no amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party.... So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin'

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 9:58 pm  
Without explicit facts, it's surely impossible for anyone on either side of the 'argument' to have an informed opinion, unless I'm missing something that's been said or done by the club/player? And then you make a judgement as to the veracity of those comments
RankPostsTeam
International Star2531
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 19 201212 years72nd
OnlineLast PostLast Page
18th Mar 24 21:0717th Mar 24 09:19LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530

Re: Shaw and Croft : Wed Dec 07, 2022 10:53 pm  
Do not know what all the fuss is about The amount of young players who we have had that according to fans are world beaters and end disappearing from the game At the end of the day could these players help to make us grade A the answer is no.We have also got some in the first team squad as well
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach5163
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 11 200419 years69th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
18th Mar 24 21:4414th Mar 24 23:28LINK
Milestone Posts
5000
10000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Orange street

Re: Shaw and Croft : Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:23 am  
Well I am still trying to find out the identity of the players agent(s) because from what I know so far a great deal of this mess seems to be down to bad advice. These two young players have paid said agent(s) from their small earnings to look after their careers. It appears all they have got from their money is to be left high and dry.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
International Chairman35904
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 13 200419 years14th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
18th Mar 24 20:159th Mar 24 16:02LINK
Milestone Posts
30000
40000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Poodle Power!
Signature
SUPPORT SWAG...

Re: Shaw and Croft : Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:53 am  
Prince Buster wrote:
Well I am still trying to find out the identity of the players agent(s) because from what I know so far a great deal of this mess seems to be down to bad advice. These two young players have paid said agent(s) from their small earnings to look after their careers. It appears all they have got from their money is to be left high and dry.


This is exactly whats happened.

However before people start the endless moralising/saviour complex nonsense lets be right about this.

It has cost the club the best part of 30-40k a player to allow these two young lads to pursue their dreams. That money one way or another comes from YOU, the fan.

Players don't have to have agents and they certainly don't have to do what they say. The fact that Croft in particular was supported through an injury by the clubs suggests to me that loyalty is a bit of a one way street,

Even if the club hold out for compensation, it won't pay anything like back the investment WE have made.We are a business first, not a dream factory, that's fine for the 80 minutes of a game but for the rest of the time it's pure economics.

You can believe me or not, but as far as I'm led to believe by various sources both were offered deals, then improved deals and both via their agents refused. The reason they can't get a gig now is because they want too much money, nothing to do with compensation, and nobody it appears would bite then or now and now everybody is spent up including us.

The reason they are in limbo is because our offer is no longer there as far as I'm aware, it's gone on other youngsters. I suspect we would waive the comp on both players with maybe one club exception, problem is I don't think anyone has the budget left to splash out on these two very unproven players, with or without compensation to us.

Sadly I suspect it's part time championship for Croft. Shaw, might cobble a deal together to allow him to stay in our reserves, but on this bit I am purely speculating.

What's truly and appallingly cynical about this is that IMO the agent has clearly fed this story to the press, in an attempt to gain a sympathy vote, and thus cover up his own ineptitude. I sincerely hope this bloke either learns quickly or has a very short career, before he ruins the careers of any more players.

One final thing to all the TRINITY ARE EVIL TO YOUNGSTERS brigade. The money allocated for Shaw and Croft has now gone to two other youngsters who were happy with the terms on offer. So the promotion of youth in percentage terms to the first team remains exactly the same.

PB, I'll PM you his name.
PreviousNext

REPLY

Subject: 
Message:
   
Please note using apple style emoji's can result in posting failures.
Use the FULL EDITOR to better format content or upload images, be notified of replies etc...

Return to Wakefield Trinity


RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
7m
Good Friday
Mark_P1973
61
13m
Other Championship Clubs
Wildthing
75
19m
Giants in the Cup - can we get Up for the Cup
Tarquin Fueg
73
21m
2024 Challenge Cup Sixth Round Draw
RAPIDO
7
39m
Ky Rodwell
Khlav Kalash
58
41m
Smith - should he stay or should he go
mwindass
177
44m
Shopping list for 2025
mwindass
286
55m
This weeks disciplinary
CW8
991
Recent
Injuries/Suspensions
Betsy Bulls
12
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
21s
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
33861
24s
Widnes programmes for sale
Brian Middle
1
27s
Other Championship Clubs
Wildthing
75
32s
State of the Nation
B0NES
153
41s
This weeks disciplinary
CW8
991
46s
Dons v York Sunday 17th March 2024 3pm
Wilf Grimsha
40
1m
Charlie Birdsall RIP
hull2524
12
1m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
leedsbarmyar
1364
1m
Rumours and signings v9
NSW
28244
1m
Bulls game
Scarlet Pimp
137
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Programmes for sale
Brian Middle
1
TODAY
Aussie programmes and books for sale
Brian Middle
1
TODAY
Widnes programmes for sale
Brian Middle
1
TODAY
Mark Campbell to step down at Fev
RoyBoy29
1
TODAY
RL Podcasts
RL Outsiders
1
TODAY
Oliver Holmes
LeythIg
4
TODAY
New Poster
BarnsleyTrin
9
TODAY
Easy Win for the Wolves Over London Moves Them Top
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Todays match v London
rubber ducki
61
TODAY
Charlie Birdsall RIP
hull2524
12
TODAY
Total rl
Bullseye
4
TODAY
Giants in the Cup - can we get Up for the Cup
Tarquin Fueg
73
TODAY
Sheffield
moto748
3
TODAY
Road Roller Required to flatten & Press
Start@1873
3
TODAY
Dragons Condemn Castleford To Another Loss
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Dreadful - Watsons future
Murphy
14
TODAY
Smith - should he stay or should he go
mwindass
177
TODAY
Leigh Leopards Secure First Points Of The Season In Style
Budgiezilla
2
TODAY
Hull FC
PopTart
13
TODAY
Oliver Russell
Wollo-Wollo-
5
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Easy Win for the Wolves Over L..
269
Dragons Condemn Castleford To ..
349
Leigh Leopards Secure First Po..
454
St Helens Tame The Rhinos To W..
472
Wigan Warriors Come From Behin..
571
Betfred Championship and Leagu..
642
2024 Challenge Cup Sixth Round..
3381
Featherstone Win Extra Time Cu..
854
Dragons Triumph Over Hull FC t..
751
Leeds Rhinos Win Game of Two H..
964
Warrington Beat Hull KR In Bre..
868
Hull FC Win At The Death To Cr..
1163
Salford Red Devils Spoil Hull ..
966
Leeds Rhinos Battle Hard for D..
1132
Warriors Maintain Great Start ..
1138
POSTSONLINEREGISTRATIONSRECORD
19.56M 3,174 79,99614,103
LOGIN HERE
or REGISTER for more features!.

When you register you get access to the live match scores, live match chat and you can post in the discussions on the forums.
RLFANS Match Centre
 Fri 29th Mar
Championship 2024-R2
18:00
Featherstone
v
Wakefield
 Sun 12th May 2024
1895 Cup 2024-R5
15:00
Bradford
v
Wakefield
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Fri 22nd Mar
CC2024
20:00
Leeds-St.Helens
Sat 23rd Mar
CC2024
14:00
Leigh-Featherstone
Thu 28th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Leeds
Fri 29th Mar
SL
12:30
Hull KR-Hull FC
SL
15:00
St.Helens-Wigan
Sat 30th Mar
SL
15:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
17:30
Salford-Leigh
Sun 31st Mar
SL
15:00
LondonB-Huddersfield
Thu 4th Apr
SL
20:00
Leigh-Wigan
Fri 5th Apr
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
SL
20:00
Hull KR-LondonB
SL
20:00
Leeds-Warrington
Sat 6th Apr
SL
15:00
Hull FC-Huddersfield
SL
17:30
Catalans-St.Helens
Fri 19th Apr
SL
20:00
Leeds-Huddersfield
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Hull FC
SL
20:00
Wigan-Castleford
Sat 20th Apr
SL
15:00
Warrington-Leigh
SL
17:30
Catalans-Hull KR
Sun 21st Apr
SL
15:00
LondonB-Salford
Sun 17th Mar
SL 5 LondonB4-58Warrington
WOMCC2024 1 Shef W10-76York V
WOMCC2024 1 Sal W0-68WiganW
WOMCC2024 1 Lei L W4-52LeedsW
CH 1 Batley20-24Featherstone
CH 1 Dewsbury10-24Halifax
CH 1 Doncaster36-20York
CH 1 Whitehaven18-16Swinton
CH 1 Widnes44-8Barrow
NRL 2 Manly21-14Sydney
NRL 2 Dolphins38-0St.George
Sat 16th Mar
SL 5 Huddersfield12-24Hull KR
SL 5 Hull FC4-54Leigh
SL 5 Catalans40-14Castleford
WOMCC2024 1 Card Wom22-16BarrowW
WOMCC2024 1 BradfordW4-52Wire W
WOMCC2024 1 St.HelensW64-0LonB W
WOMCC2024 1 Hudds W74-0HKR Wom
NRL 2 Canberra32-12Wests
NRL 2 NQL Cowboys21-20Newcastle
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Warrington 5 156 58 98 8
Wigan 4 144 54 90 8
St.Helens 5 118 40 78 8
Catalans 5 126 54 72 8
Hull KR 5 98 63 35 6
Leeds 5 82 82 0 6
 
Salford 5 95 96 -1 6
Huddersfield 5 94 98 -4 4
Leigh 4 82 54 28 2
Hull FC 5 54 162 -108 2
Castleford 5 56 178 -122 0
LondonB 5 54 220 -166 0
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Widnes 1 44 8 36 2
Wakefield 1 42 12 30 2
Doncaster 1 36 20 16 2
Halifax 1 24 10 14 2
Featherstone 1 24 20 4 2
Sheffield 1 24 22 2 2
 
Whitehaven 1 18 16 2 2
Toulouse 1 22 24 -2 0
Swinton 1 16 18 -2 0
Batley 1 20 24 -4 0
Dewsbury 1 10 24 -14 0
York 1 20 36 -16 0
Bradford 1 12 42 -30 0
Barrow 1 8 44 -36 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
7m
Good Friday
Mark_P1973
61
13m
Other Championship Clubs
Wildthing
75
19m
Giants in the Cup - can we get Up for the Cup
Tarquin Fueg
73
21m
2024 Challenge Cup Sixth Round Draw
RAPIDO
7
39m
Ky Rodwell
Khlav Kalash
58
41m
Smith - should he stay or should he go
mwindass
177
44m
Shopping list for 2025
mwindass
286
55m
This weeks disciplinary
CW8
991
Recent
Injuries/Suspensions
Betsy Bulls
12
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
21s
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
33861
24s
Widnes programmes for sale
Brian Middle
1
27s
Other Championship Clubs
Wildthing
75
32s
State of the Nation
B0NES
153
41s
This weeks disciplinary
CW8
991
46s
Dons v York Sunday 17th March 2024 3pm
Wilf Grimsha
40
1m
Charlie Birdsall RIP
hull2524
12
1m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
leedsbarmyar
1364
1m
Rumours and signings v9
NSW
28244
1m
Bulls game
Scarlet Pimp
137
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Programmes for sale
Brian Middle
1
TODAY
Aussie programmes and books for sale
Brian Middle
1
TODAY
Widnes programmes for sale
Brian Middle
1
TODAY
Mark Campbell to step down at Fev
RoyBoy29
1
TODAY
RL Podcasts
RL Outsiders
1
TODAY
Oliver Holmes
LeythIg
4
TODAY
New Poster
BarnsleyTrin
9
TODAY
Easy Win for the Wolves Over London Moves Them Top
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Todays match v London
rubber ducki
61
TODAY
Charlie Birdsall RIP
hull2524
12
TODAY
Total rl
Bullseye
4
TODAY
Giants in the Cup - can we get Up for the Cup
Tarquin Fueg
73
TODAY
Sheffield
moto748
3
TODAY
Road Roller Required to flatten & Press
Start@1873
3
TODAY
Dragons Condemn Castleford To Another Loss
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Dreadful - Watsons future
Murphy
14
TODAY
Smith - should he stay or should he go
mwindass
177
TODAY
Leigh Leopards Secure First Points Of The Season In Style
Budgiezilla
2
TODAY
Hull FC
PopTart
13
TODAY
Oliver Russell
Wollo-Wollo-
5
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Easy Win for the Wolves Over L..
269
Dragons Condemn Castleford To ..
349
Leigh Leopards Secure First Po..
454
St Helens Tame The Rhinos To W..
472
Wigan Warriors Come From Behin..
571
Betfred Championship and Leagu..
642
2024 Challenge Cup Sixth Round..
3381
Featherstone Win Extra Time Cu..
854
Dragons Triumph Over Hull FC t..
751
Leeds Rhinos Win Game of Two H..
964
Warrington Beat Hull KR In Bre..
868
Hull FC Win At The Death To Cr..
1163
Salford Red Devils Spoil Hull ..
966
Leeds Rhinos Battle Hard for D..
1132
Warriors Maintain Great Start ..
1138


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!