World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:06 am  

Despite Trojans admirable efforts, am I the only one who saw very little available raw/unknown quality at this WC.

I watched every game and not a single available player stood out. Despite what people say PNG were poor and the supposed toughness of their pack a bit of a joke. Fiji no more flair than Dewsbury in March IMHO. Lebanon, a great effort, but quality, err no.

Truth is the NRL is now far bigger and the second grade competitions also offers a decent living to a lot of players who twenty years ago would have made their way to the UK.

Let's concentrate on our Academy and British players we can pick up from other SL clubs or the Championship. It's far easier, probably far cheaper and frankly the players look far better. If later next year some quality in the NRL is freed up then fine, but most will likely be snapped up by other NRL teams in truth.

Sad, but the much vaunted quota spot is becoming a touch redundant imho as there is not much to fill it with, hence the drive by clubs like Saints and Leeds in particular to hoover up any potential young talent outside the SL.

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:26 am  

vastman wrote:

Despite Trojans admirable efforts, am I the only one who saw very little available raw/unknown quality at this WC.

I watched every game and not a single available player stood out. Despite what people say PNG were poor and the supposed toughness of their pack a bit of a joke. Fiji no more flair than Dewsbury in March IMHO. Lebanon, a great effort, but quality, err no.

Truth is the NRL is now far bigger and the second grade competitions also offers a decent living to a lot of players who twenty years ago would have made their way to the UK.

Let's concentrate on our Academy and British players we can pick up from other SL clubs or the Championship. It's far easier, probably far cheaper and frankly the players look far better. If later next year some quality in the NRL is freed up then fine, but most will likely be snapped up by other NRL teams in truth.

Sad, but the much vaunted quota spot is becoming a touch redundant imho as there is not much to fill it with, hence the drive by clubs like Saints and Leeds in particular to hoover up any potential young talent outside the SL.

Maybe for a club like ours the quota spot may not be as valuable, however there are still lots of top quality players coming to SL from the NRL.

The last I heard we were talking with 4 overseas players, so I think the club/MA still think they get something in those players that isn`t available to us here and I tend to agree with them.

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:43 am  

I'm a little puzzled because of our apparent lack of progress - I would have thought if we had players in the bag we'd have announced it as we did with Proctor. Does that mean the right quality player simply isn't available?

I was hoping we'd pick up a Stanley Gene type player but most of those coming under the guise of such as Lebanon, Greece etc etc, of good enough quality, are already with Aussie clubs!
Perhaps I've got it wrong but the silence is a little deafening and worrying we may have missed the boat with the 'stars' from down under!

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 8:47 am  

Although I thought Wakeham was a bit hit and miss in the group games, I thought in the quarter final, when Fiji were on top, he was bossing the game, against Kiwi halves with much more experience. He has utility value too, by being capable of playing at 9, which is something our current overseas player isn't willing to.

Also, I did like Laybutt, and again, has utility value, by being able to play in the halves, and at 13. Solid in defence, and looked to be more of an organiser.

I do think either of these could have done a job for us, and both are, or were looking to play in the super league

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:14 am  

Eastern Wildcat wrote:

Although I thought Wakeham was a bit hit and miss in the group games, I thought in the quarter final, when Fiji were on top, he was bossing the game, against Kiwi halves with much more experience. He has utility value too, by being capable of playing at 9, which is something our current overseas player isn't willing to.

Also, I did like Laybutt, and again, has utility value, by being able to play in the halves, and at 13. Solid in defence, and looked to be more of an organiser.

I do think either of these could have done a job for us, and both are, or were looking to play in the super league

Laybutt is 28 with one NRL game.

People seem to think Morgan Smith is a punt but he has 30+ SL games to his name - I'd rather sign more Morgan Smith TBH.

Think you're being hugely generous to Wakeham.

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:22 am  

It's not just signing though is it. Visa and work permits etc need to be obtained although in some cases it's straight forward but can take time. Ink won't be dry until all processes are complete. For me I would look at home not sure what some overseas players bring to the game other than preventing the development of UK players we all know what the result of that brings. Perhaps grade A licences will allow clubs the ability to develop local talent

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:23 am  

homme vaste wrote:

Maybe for a club like ours the quota spot may not be as valuable, however there are still lots of top quality players coming to SL from the NRL.

The last I heard we were talking with 4 overseas players, so I think the club/MA still think they get something in those players that isn`t available to us here and I tend to agree with them.

Yes but we can't afford them can we, You call them quality but they are clearly on the way down or they wouldn't be coming to SL. The NRL is awash with cash, if an established player can't get an NRL gig, he's not the player he was, not these days. Name a single Aussie/Kiwi/Samoan/Tongan international whose likely to trouble SL any time soon.

Munster said it all for me and we still fall for it. He states, 'I'll be finished in the NRL by the time i'm 33 so s few years in SL looks inviting' FFS cheeky tw*t. Read I'll pick up my pension in SL.

For us the only way IMHO we win with the quota players is the only way w'eve ever one and it's not with big name reputation players. It's with your Whitbreads, Fifitas and Tupou's, second chance players.

Prescott may or may not be a good signing for us, but he's no longer close to the player he once was, we need to be realistic. My hope is that he wants to go out on a high and do something a bit special, like lead a team like us.

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 9:24 am  

REDWHITEANDBLUE wrote:

It's not just signing though is it. Visa and work permits etc need to be obtained although in some cases it's straight forward but can take time. Ink won't be dry until all processes are complete. For me I would look at home not sure what some overseas players bring to the game other than preventing the development of UK players we all know what the result of that brings. Perhaps grade A licences will allow clubs the ability to develop local talent

Add to that agents who keep players on the market as long as possible and play clubs off against each other.

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 10:04 am  

vastman wrote:

Laybutt is 28 with one NRL game.

People seem to think Morgan Smith is a punt but he has 30+ SL games to his name - I'd rather sign more Morgan Smith TBH.

Think you're being hugely generous to Wakeham.

A lack of NRL game time doesn't make them out to be a bad player, and shouldn't be judged

How many games of topflight rugby league did Chris Perry, JD, and another mentioned in this thread, Stanley Gene, play between them?

They all managed to carve out decent careers over here.

FWIW, I've seen the highlights of Smith, looks pretty good, and had I think 2 seasons playing for a good Warrington side, and got about 25 games, while competing with the likes of Gidley, Sandow, Patton and I think even Roberts, so that's not a bad return. He was only 18-19 when he was with them.

Re: World Cup player let down : Fri Nov 18, 2022 11:13 am  

Eastern Wildcat wrote:

A lack of NRL game time doesn't make them out to be a bad player, and shouldn't be judged

How many games of topflight rugby league did Chris Perry, JD, and another mentioned in this thread, Stanley Gene, play between them?

They all managed to carve out decent careers over here.

FWIW, I've seen the highlights of Smith, looks pretty good, and had I think 2 seasons playing for a good Warrington side, and got about 25 games, while competing with the likes of Gidley, Sandow, Patton and I think even Roberts, so that's not a bad return. He was only 18-19 when he was with them.

I agree, to an extent but things have changed dramatically since then. The point I'm making is that players like JD or Perry would probably now stay in Oz and play second grade, they may even have got a gig for the Dolphins to add depth or be set up for Perth in a few years time. To know how player hungry the NRL now is, you only have to look at Dom Young with 2 SL games to his name, or better still a former Trinity Academy player Wesley Bruins, who virtually none of us had ever heard of, got a one year development deal in Oz and could have stayed there if he'd wanted to.

SL for most Southern Hemisphere players is really a last ditch these days, unless they are star signings, which I suppose Prescott just about is and thus on decent money compared to what they would get in Oz.

For me it's slim pickings, and thats why I understand why a thoughtful coaching team like Applegarth/Ford are taking their time. I'm sure there are still some out there but we won't be the only ones looking, so it's hard work. So with that in mind I do think Leeds have the right idea on Championship second chancers.

Back to the main point, I still wasn't impressed with many of the players I saw who weren't already tied to the NRL.